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  #1  
Old 11-09-2005, 08:53 PM
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danausmc danausmc is offline
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Blue Important.....please read

Duplicate of post in OIF forum.

On the eve of the Marine Corps Birthday, I received this e-mail forward.....please read it.....if you are an OIF or Afghan Vet, don't , and I mean this most sincerely, don't ever feel you are alone.(that goes for the rest of you vets too) there are enough guys here and available that are willing to meet with you, talk, or just communicate on the web......don't withdraw.....you are in the fight of your life right now, and its for your soul.
Don't give up...there is always a way out and it is not, I repeat, not dangle...or a cap. Please don't ever give up.

Read this e-mail and see the pain in this mans letter.....and grieve for this young Marine and family, but don't give up and follow his lead. use it to strengthen your own resolve. I know there is someone who will read this tonight and see themselves. I am praying for you right now and don't even know you.

here is the e-mail.




I'm sorry I can't make it tonight. You see my young Marine, My grandson killed himself last night. Just six weeks after returning from Iraq. Another victim of war. He was so young, like most of us who went to war and return home not knowing how to get help with our feelings. These are UN-know victims that the public hears very little about. I ask that you keep My doughtier and all of my family in your prayers. I just pray that God gives me the strength to make it through today.

Jerry we need to do more to help these young Men and Women who are returning from these war zones. We need to reach out as far as we can to help these young Men and Women and their families.



May God Bless you All
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  #2  
Old 11-17-2005, 05:47 AM
charlie wardog
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Blue Re: Important.....please read

Dana, you are so right. We as Point Man must be willing to meet this guys and GALS where they are at. It may be a bar or a church.

We can also educate the public. If we can educate the public then when some guy is being erratic they will understand and seek help for the troop.

Questions #1- How many outposts welcome all veterans. War, Peace, Men, Women.

If they are not they may be rejecting some of those with the answers.

My heart aches everytime I read an email like the one you posted. It ticks me off that we can have all these veterans across the country and so few are willing to step up.

Question #2- Are we willing to work outside of Point Man to partner with other Non-Point Man groups to work together.
VVA
VFW

Legion
AMVETS
DAV
Local Veterans Service Commission
& Even civilians. Those who have never served but can help.

Local Mental Health Boards etc...

Christ has called us to be disciples and he did not mean IN the church. The church needs help to but I think MY mission is outside the church.

If your comfortable then you may not be doing everything you can to serve God. Get uncomfortable! Take Action. Don't wait for the FO's to call in for support. Call in your own fire mission and fire. Just make sure you are doing God's will and not your will.
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  #3  
Old 11-20-2005, 06:30 AM
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Re: Important.....please read

Quote:
Originally Posted by charlie wardog
Dana, you are so right. We as Point Man must be willing to meet this guys and GALS where they are at. It may be a bar or a church.

We can also educate the public. If we can educate the public then when some guy is being erratic they will understand and seek help for the troop.

Questions #1- How many outposts welcome all veterans. War, Peace, Men, Women.

If they are not they may be rejecting some of those with the answers.

My heart aches everytime I read an email like the one you posted. It ticks me off that we can have all these veterans across the country and so few are willing to step up.

Question #2- Are we willing to work outside of Point Man to partner with other Non-Point Man groups to work together.
VVA
VFW

Legion
AMVETS
DAV
Local Veterans Service Commission
& Even civilians. Those who have never served but can help.

Local Mental Health Boards etc...

Christ has called us to be disciples and he did not mean IN the church. The church needs help to but I think MY mission is outside the church.

If your comfortable then you may not be doing everything you can to serve God. Get uncomfortable! Take Action. Don't wait for the FO's to call in for support. Call in your own fire mission and fire. Just make sure you are doing God's will and not your will.
Lot of good questions here Matt. Most answer themselves.
Some outposts dont even meet and others are all over the place through out their respective communities.
How many do you see on here sharing ideas and ????
Post some pictures from your meeting with the group....Im sure others will be interested.
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  #4  
Old 11-26-2005, 04:47 PM
Don Dodson Don Dodson is offline
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Blue Re: Important.....please read

Good reminders: we are to be God's grunts on the ground, as well as His air and sea forces. I find that when Point Man comes up even with non-veterans, I often hear a story about a veteran, living or dead. The more we share our mission, the more people God brings to us to support the work. I have not made any liaisons from the La Mesa Outpost to the other veterans groups (except VVA) since the others' primary focus is maintainting their low cost bars.

WELCOME HOME!

Don "Oboeman" Dodson
Outpost Leader, La Mesa California
PointManMinLaMesa@NothernTrail.net
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  #5  
Old 11-27-2005, 11:38 AM
charlie wardog
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Confused Re: Important.....please read

Can you find one or two guys from those other groups who are willing to stand by your side and work with you at veteran functions? By having those outside your organization stand with you makes a statement.

What do we need to do to let just a few guys that we are not here to preach to them but to love them where they are? Although our purpose is to spread the gospel why can we not build relationships that may or will lead to sharing the gospel.

I have found that I was intially intimidated to approach these other groups because of my age. 34 Years old. I felt that I did not measure up to those older guys. HOwver, over time God brought a few to me and I got over my trepedation.

Questions:
Who are we trying to reach? Vet/Family etc...
Do we accept we no hesitation a woman, national guard, reservist from the Nam era?
DO we scare some off by our presentation?
Will we accept a non-vet in our group?
Is Homefront open to those not married to Vet?

All these questions in my eyes are very important and relevant. The way to a vet is sometimes a long trip and we may need to go in the back door. Through the neighbors house or a friend.

I recently spoke to a Iraq Vet who spoke to a non-vet and the non-vet could not understand why this guy is disabled. We know why but those outside of our circle just don't get it.

How can we educate the public?

Are we serving God's mission or the one we are comfrtable with? Are we willing to go out of our comfort zone to reach someone.

My wife hates to speak to crowds. However, she felt she could serve Christ by sharing her story and has now spoke to 4 large groups about life ofa Nam vet daughter and wife of a Gulf War Vet.

It just ticks me off that the guys sitting around a bar are pulling the guys down we are trying to help. We MUST get to the guys on the bar stools. We MUST make them understand that their struggles can help other guys like them as well as themselves.
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  #6  
Old 12-12-2005, 06:19 PM
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reply from Dallee

Our friend dallee has sent this reply and I am posting it.....Thanks Dale.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
I have read with great interest the questions and comments in this and other forums. I have tried to avoid commenting as I am neither a vet nor a vet's wife or daughter. I hear the desperate desire in you to "reach out" and to "educate the public". I have shared those same feelings for a long time. I was "educated" by a visit to the moving wall. Although I do not know what group it was that was handing out literature and manning the wall they were there for their brothers... it was obvious.
I have no answers for you. If you know of a way to motivate vets to accept that someone really does care for them please share it. In my experience the ones we want to reach out to have decided they don't want our help and that no non-brother could possibly ever understand (and just being a vet does not make you a brother).
It has been most frustrating for me to be rejected time and again. Embarrassed that I tried and failed, I stopped trying for a time. I simply did not know what to do. Then I made a decision. No matter who was around, no matter what the circumstances I was going to say thank you to every vet I met, and keep saying it until they heard me. I must admit that the guys from viet nam hold a special place in my heart, and I probably seek them out a little more than any others. I have learned to recognize a large number of them simply by a look in the eyes.
The only way I have ever made true contact with them has been individually, and then only after I have insisted that they take me seriously and not just blow me off as a bleeding heart. The problem I have heard over and over again is that a lot of people say they love vets, sort of like loving hot dogs at a baseball game .
Here is a quote from a recent conversation with a viet nam vet friend of mine. " love the vets like you would love anyone Christ said to love, as for helping them to feel that love, to believe in it, to trust it, forget it. its been to long , to much of an insult. you couldn't make me feel appreciated , if you had a party for me every day I have left." Unfortunately this is not an uncommon response also it is not one said with bitterness but in sincerity.
Do we truly love the vet? Or are we on our own mission to prove to him that God can change him and make him whole again? Do we want to get him cleaned up and off the dope and off the booze and back with his family and in church? Is that always possible? Is that what he wants? Is that what God wants? Is that loving the vet?
Will anything short of loving the vet do? I don't think we can reach out to them in a group setting. Most avoid groups like the plague. In fact the ones I have spoken with have had enough of groups. They view them as lame and focused only on the survival of their own little group and "MAKING you fit into it".
I know this all sounds very negative. Lord knows I don't want it to. I want more than anything in the world to reach these men and women with the gospel of Christ. In other forums on here we have read that the military is now pouring billions more into educating soldiers on PTSD symptoms yet we all know that money will be used to first do a study of the problem and then a group will have to discuss how to best meet the needs of all involved... and in a couple of years there will be a plan of action put together. In the mean time soldiers are killing themselves. I really believe that this site is an excellent tool... if we could just get them to come here. When do you normally feel the most stress? Isn't it normally late at night when there is nothing to do and no place to turn? And isn't it normally when you are alone? (or at least have created a situation that will give you an excuse for being alone) What better tool could there be than a place a man can go on his own without having to answer questions or assure anyone he is ok? The big question remains how do we get them here? Is this site mentioned in any of the material soldiers are given? If not how can it get put there? Otherwise the only means I can see is to simply love one at a time and gently guide him here.
As for educating the public, to be frank the public does not care. If the public cared at all we would not have to fight so hard to simply provide health care for our veterans. We live in a society that has no sense of respect. The aged are throw away people, Adult survivors of child molestation are told to "get over it", mentally handicapped people are either institutionalized or discounted because we simply haven't the time to deal with them. Children in school spend half of the time there learning to fit into the system instead of the ABC's and how to add and read, and God forbid if an 8 year old doesn't want to go to the restroom-change shoes-and be in the correct line within the allotted 5 minutes--WHERE IS THE RIDDLIN?
Again the only way I can see to accomplish our goal is one-on-one action. Tis a long process, I know but we must duplicate ourselves by instilling our knowledge and love on a one-to-one basis. Then encouraging our students to do the same. "EACH ONE REACH ONE"(at a time). Many times I have brought a hurting soul to this site. Some stay, others do not but they let me take their hand for a moment and show them what is available should they choose to visit again.
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Old 12-12-2005, 09:17 PM
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Angeldevil Re: Important.....please read

This is a poor attempt at answering your questions, at best! Forgive me if I come off as being harsh or insensitive.

(1) You do not have to be a Combat Vet, but it helps! But most of all just know that you are needed!

(2) The only way we can show a Vet we care is to KEEP TRYING! Even when the Vet says NO! You do not give up! To quote an old statement "WE DON'T LEAVE ANYONE BEHIND, NO MATTER WHAT THE COST"! I know it can get flustrating, believe me. Had not some of my few friends been there for me I would be dead now. They did not give up, even when I physically fought them in a misguided attempt at suicide! Yes on 2/3/05 I attempted to commit suicide and was stopped ONLY BY AN ACT OF GOD! A local Chaplin stopped by my home to give me a book on PTSD as I was going outside to kill myself. Had he not come by I would have killed myself. I normally would not reveal this to most people, however your questions prompted this.

(3) Being "Born Again" I spend many hours a day studying the Bible. Probably more than my health can/should stand. However, the more I read the more I learn about facing adversity. Can you imagine the fight Jesus had? Did he give up? I think not!

(4) The ONLY THING that gets through to a Vet is persistance and honesty! We can be extremely hard headed, but once we realize that you are being honest & sincere, we will open up. FIRST OF ALL YOU HAVE TO REALIZE, WE DO NOT TRUST ANYONE, NOT OURSELVES, NOT FAMILY MEMBERS, NO ONE!

We have learned not to let anyone get close to us emotionally, for any reason. People die and if you don't let them get close for any reason! Remember, our first response is "IT DON'T MEAN A THING" or "IT AIN'T NOTHING BUT A THING"!

We will open up, then close up, then re-open. You just have to keep at us.

(5) It took me 34 years to realize I had a problem! I guess I am a slow learner. You have to also remember that during our youth there was no such thing as PTSD, there was just "WACKED OUT DOPER VIET NAM VETS".

No one knew there was such as a thing as PTSD and we were just written off as being dopers! Most of us do not realize we were affected. It is just a way of life to us. Also most of our parents were WW2 Vets and serving our country was supposed to be an honor. To go to Canada was not an option!!! Nor do our families realize that we were affected differently during "our war" than the majority of the WW2 Vets.

You have to realize that we may not even be aware that we have a problem. To us we are normal, the rest of the world is just wierd and unaware to the danger around them! It is a life style that many of us have grown up with without being aware of the impact that war had on us.

WE DO NOT KNOW THAT WE HAVE A PROBLEM UNTIL WE GET "BUSTED" OR IN SITUATION THAT FORCES US TO FACE OURSELVES, and then and only then will we come to grips with our problem. It is just recently that PTSD has become "fashionable" or a recognized illness.

(5) Most of us deal with such a guilt complex that we think we are "just doomed" and will not believe that there is salvation for us. Even when someone tells us time and time again, we just keep believing that even Jesus Christ could not/will not forgive us.

(6) Read Chuck Dean's book "VIET NAM VET" for a little insight on how we perceive the world. It is scary, believe me! I had the fortune to meet Chuck in person, and it was wonderful. Seeing him is person was what it took to make me open up to my family & other vets. He is a powerful speaker!

I can not explain the feeling that came over me when I first read the book (I had to read it multiple times & to date have read it over 50 times and still learn more about myself each time I read it) and then meeting Chuck in person. IT WAS LIKE BEING GIVEN A PARDON ON DEATH ROW AT THE FINAL MINUTE!

(7) Is it always possible to clean up a Vet? Absolutely not! We have to first realize we have a problem and then decide to do something about it. You, not even Jesus, can save someone who does not want to clean up/be saved!

First we have to hit "bottom" in most cases to be able to face up to our weakness. Be it alcohol or drugs, and it does not matter weather they are illegal or prescribed medications.

DON'T GIVE UP! WE CAN BE SAVED, BUT IT TAKES A LOT OF WORK, MORE THAN MOST PEOPLE ARE WILLING TO GIVE.

(8) Most of us avoid groups because we can not "hide" from each other! When we are "one on one" with an outsider such as yourself or a counselor we can hide our inner feelings, but a Vet will spot the "shine on-bulls__t" in a minute.

(9) When do we feel the most stress? That is a difficult question. We can be "triggered" by alot of different things. Odors, sounds, situations, the list is endless! Yes for alot of us it is being alone, but most of us seek solitude to avoid the stressors as they are generally triggered by other people just living day to day life.

(10) Love? Most of us do not comprehend love. We think we feel it for people such as our immediate family, but we are not sure of our emotions enough to understand what real love is. You have to remember we have been stuffing emotions so long that we do not even know what they are anymore!

(11) How do we get the Vet's to this site? With hard work and a never quit attitude! We just have to keep working, just as Jesus did when faced with rejection.

(12) You are on the right track! You just have to keep going, no matter how hard we resist. Even when faced with rejection just keep trying!

I know this sounds like preaching, but I do not intend it that way. I'm just trying to give you a view from our side of the window.

I'f I can be of assistance in any way please feel free to call me 24/7. I will be glad to PM you with my phone number. As I am sure Dana and everyone else has offered. We don't have all the answers, only Jesus has that, but we will do our best to answer you questions & be of assistance.
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Old 12-26-2005, 08:58 PM
Don Dodson Don Dodson is offline
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Re: Important.....please read

Great points, Frank!

Don "Oboevet" Dodson
Vietnam 1969-1970
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Old 12-27-2005, 09:31 AM
dallee
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Re: Important.....please read

I can see that you put a lot of time and thought into responding to my comment. It seems to have really sparked something in you. It is good to see people so eager to reach out and help in any way they can.

Frank, I have no intention of giving up. I do not claim to understand the vet... especially not the viet nam vet... and I hope honestly I never will. In order to understand, one must first experience what they have experienced. I thank God himself that I never have. I thank you all for placing yourself in such a position, even though you didn't know me, for me and for my family. No matter your political views today, at the time we each did only what we thought was right or necessary and what we were told. For that I am always grateful.

Thank you also for putting so much feeling into words. Sometimes even the things we think we know need to be seen in print. Perhaps for confirmation, encouragement, or even just to know someone else is reading what you type. Yes the vet can be saved, I agree. Yes we do have to keep at it.

For a person who has not been there it is so frustrating and at the same time fascinating. I keep thinking "It has been thirty years" -- "THIRTY YEARS!" Still every single aspect of his life is somehow related to that one year or two years he spent in the jungles of Viet Nam.
EVERY conversation.
EVERY plan.
EVERY relationship.
EVERY time he looks out the window.
EVERY time it rains.
EVERY time it is hot.
Every unusual sound on a quiet night.
Every lapse in security.
EVERY time he goes to sleep.
EVERY time he sits up in the chair trying not to go to sleep.
Every tear...shed or not.

One thing I have notice within me is that when I first meet a vet I am extremely patient with him, very loving and forgiving. After a couple of years though I find myself becoming frustrated with the very things that made me connect with him in the first place. It just seems that He dosen't want to be helped and that I am botherig him simply by contacting him. So I back off a bit. Once you begin to back off it isn't long before backing off becomes little or no contact, and his paradigm of "see, they all disapear in time" is confirmed. It isn't intentional and I don't realize it until I see a tribute or a show or meet someone new and feel the heart strings being pulled. Then I remember all that he went through and I feel so bad for being lackadaisical about someone I call my friend. At that point I have learned not to ask forgiveness from the vet. ("it's no thing" is an annoying response.) I just realign myself with God and ask His help in getting me back on track. I struggle with wondering if I am really helping or am I just adding more fuel to the fire?

As I said ... I do not and probably will never.... claim to understand the combat vet. Yet my soul aches for you all. I realize that there is nothing I can do to make it different. However, if Jesus can use my hands, my mouth, my heart, my soul and show you just a glimpse of His healing power... His loving touch... then they are His to use.

Your "Answers" were well received Frank. Again I thank you for putting so much time and thought into something I said.

Let's keep talking about it. Maybe someone else will feel compelled to contribute to the discussion.
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Old 12-27-2005, 10:50 PM
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Bounce Re: Important.....please read

Good to hear from you dallee,

I am usually on the site at about 2100 PST every night. I always check to see what my brothers are up to and help when I can.

As far as answers, I don't know that I have any. I do have lots of questions. I understand about getting further away from the vet after awhile. It is flustrating, believe me I know! I have asked myself many times why Viet Nam still upsets us and causes us to react the way we do, even today. Yes, it has been 30+ years for most us. I myself wonder why it took so many years for me to realize that I had PTSD and then I realized that I had it all along. It just never was pointed out due to my life style and the fact most people do not understand it.

Take myself for instance. I hid in the Army for 18+ years. I was never stationed anywhere more than the minimum time required before I put my self on levy for movement. By the time I had spent 18-24 months at one place I was starting to burn bridges, but I would volunteer for less than glamourous assignments so I was always moving, vs getting fired or quiting civilian jobs. And I always volunteered for any type of training, irreguardless of how hard the school was. I was a "Hard Charger" according to a Col. who was my rater on a EER (fitness evaluation). Plus, my state of "readyness" is/was a plus for tactical units. Nobody noticed the fact I was drinking heavy-that was accepted behavior as long as it never affected your work. And I tended to take assignments that no one else would volunteer for, especially if it involved danger. (Now days that is recognized as "self destructive" behavior). Besides ARMY Shrinks are a joke. Anyone who has ever had to go for Psyc Evals due to job assignments very quickly learned how to "shine" them on. We know what answers their looking for and which ones will end your career!

I got in trouble many times, however I also was well liked by my superiors due to job performance, etc. I was in the Army "Good Old Boy" club & we take care of ourselves! Work hard, play hard, take any assignment-no matter what or how dirty! That will get a lot of mileage from a CO who is trying to impress the brass, and that is all CO's!

You have to realize that we have developed a complete lifestyle that "covers" our problem most of the time. We have trained ourselves to never let anyone get close to us (people die), and any problem that irritates us is someone else's problem-not ours! Then something happens to bring it out to public attention. Then we "Go to Hell in a hand basket" so to speak and our lives start to crumble around our feet.

It usually takes some type of "event" that sets us off. Then our PTSD symptoms come out to the forefront and start to become very noticeable.

Alot of RVN Vet's families became enablers with out even suspecting it. Also we became great liars to cover up our "little quirks". It was easy for us to blame someone else for incidents and not understand how we are/were affected.

I think back on my life now and see the multitude of incidents that I over-reacted to and it is down right scary! You have to realize also that at the time I would never have believed someone telling me I was over reacting! When you look at the symptoms of PTSD and think about it, we are not that different than anyone else-We just magnify everything and take it personally.

We discovered we had been lied to by so many people (basically our own country and it's politicions) and the fact that our families expected us to go to war to defend them from the heathen commies. After that we learned to never trust anyone for any reason-PEOPLE LIE TO YOU!!!

After loosing buddies, getting lied to by your own country, being told to "Get over it, your not the only one who went to war, we fought a "REAL WAR" buddy". We just learned to stuff every emotion, remember "Big Boys Don't Cry".

After stuffing all your emotions for years, it takes a toll on a person's head. After we realize that we do in fact have a problem we then began to doubt ourselves even more than we do you, so we again revert back to "stuffing" things. This is why so many of us turned to alcohol/drugs. Look up alcoholic and you will discover alot of information. Being a drunk does not mean falling down and living in a gutter all the time! There are a lot of very successful alcoholic/workaholics that are never thought of as having a problem with alcohol or drugs in society today that function very well in the public eye. We are just hiding our pain from mainstream America/public.

Believe us when we say "It don't mean nothing" as we can and will walk away from anything for any reason before we will make ourselves vulnurable to people.

First we have to learn to trust again, and that is a big one for us! We can and will spot being "BS'ed" in a second. Once we learn to trust someone you must understand that it is very fragile! Under no cercumstances can you violate our trust for any reason. Don't make a promise you can not keep to us or we will just shut back down.

Also realize that it is hard for us to open up or talk to someone who we do care about (spouse-family) as we have something vested it them. We talk to each other because we understand each other's emotional pains, plus we have nothing to loose by talking to each other. The other Vet has been there, done that, got the T-shirt. When talking to family we are afraid that you are going to look at us like we were the Devil himself and be afraid. That is a great fear with us. We in our own way love you, but we are afraid of causing you to fear us. Remember we are dealing with a 900# gorilla on our back called "GUILT". And it drives us to great lengths!

Only by reaching out to the Lord can we overcome our guilt. Remember we have had years to develope the guilt and today's society just keeps adding to it. The more we find out about Viet Nam policy and lies, the more guilt we add to our gorilla! That is the hardest thing for us to do is learn that we are not above being forgiven by the Lord. (Most of us believe the Lord went AWOL and left us to die in Viet Nam). Jesus died for our sins long before we commited them. We just have to keep being told that and by someone we trust.

Plus in many cases you already have one strike against you! You are a woman, and I don't mean that sexist!!! Read Chuck's book-if you can't get one PM me with your address and I will send you one at no cost. We learned not to trust females, both during Basic Training, Viet Nam, and upon arriving home!

Hope I haven't defeated my purpose by trying to give you an insite of what you are dealing with. Remember, this is only my .02 worth and doesn't fit everyone of us.

Keep up the good work-WE NEED MORE LIKE YOU!!!

Till next time,
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Old 01-23-2006, 12:32 AM
chapmic
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Re: Important.....please read

Yes, I too believe many of your questions are also inherently positive answers. Many of our Outposts work in and outside the structured Church. Yet the word "church" in Greek simply means "people". We in Tucson, meet at a lovely little Church owned by "Church On the Street". We ask for the guidance of the Holy Spirit and the working out our salvation is generally right in front of us waiting for the open arms of a comrade.
Referrals and visitors come from all of the Fraternal Orgs. Legion/VFW/VVA and tons from the VA Hospital PTSD program. My wifes website for the wives of Vets gets inquiries every week from VA referrals. (MSN Groups) Living With PTSD Vietnam Wives) PMIM is pretty well known here in the West.
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Old 01-23-2006, 12:35 AM
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Re: Important.....please read

I think I just posted this in the wrong thread. Oh well, let me go search for the right one.
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Old 02-17-2006, 06:30 AM
dallee
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Re: Important.....please read

Frank, it was nice to read your post. Yes I have read Chuck's books. I am quite fond of his writing. I appreciate your input. Yes I have read all of those facts before on what ptsd is and how to recognize it, still each time I look at an individual with symptoms I cannot help but be overwhelmed at all he has gone through and at how it has affected him for all of this time. It is truely heartwrenching. Like watching the children in the cancer unit of the hospital. You know they suffer, you know what they are most likely in for. You know there is nothing you can do. .......... I will try to write more soon
Dallee
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  #14  
Old 02-18-2006, 05:03 AM
pointmanben
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Re: Important.....please read

Questions #1- How many outposts welcome all veterans. War, Peace, Men, Women.

If they are not they may be rejecting some of those with the answers.

My heart aches everytime I read an email like the one you posted. It ticks me off that we can have all these veterans across the country and so few are willing to step up.

Question #2- Are we willing to work outside of Point Man to partner with other Non-Point Man groups to work together.
VVA
VFW

Legion
AMVETS
DAV
Local Veterans Service Commission
& Even civilians. Those who have never served but can help.

Local Mental Health Boards etc...

Christ has called us to be disciples and he did not mean IN the church. The church needs help to but I think MY mission is outside the church.

If your comfortable then you may not be doing everything you can to serve God. Get uncomfortable! Take Action. Don't wait for the FO's to call in for support. Call in your own fire mission and fire. Just make sure you are doing God's will and not your will.
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Well said Matt, I sometimes wonder about those who stay comfortable inside the church... but I won't go there now. Our Outpost (& D.A.V. Chapter) is open by phone or personal visit 24/7 and there are may old timers with the same problems that won't come to an Outpost meeting or attend church so you have to meet them where they are comfortable. I'm a member of a church but the pastor knows that my ministry to veterans comes first, and that the congregation I've been called to work with is in the streets, homeless shelters or in the local coffee shops. Too many church's pick & choose who they want in their attendance and some of the smelly, dirty brothers who really need ministering to are left by the side of the road. I've seen several messages on muslims hating those who are not of their faith. One of my friends told me that his church "Hates" me for what I do. God is not in every church, in fact, the only time HE attends, is when a believer, and do'er carries HIM through the door. You will find HIM on the streets though.
Keep on keeping on.
Ben
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  #15  
Old 12-26-2009, 08:09 AM
Louonamac
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Re: Important.....please read

My life is all I have to give away, offering some links to a biography but giving much attention to Vietnam and beyond, having gone from PTSD to total insanity and back.

http://www.4shared.com/file/17988302..._Stress-1.html
http://www.4shared.com/file/17972691..._Maniac_1.html
http://www.vietvet.org/loutplei.htm
http://www.amazon.com/Gods-Maniac-Lo...owViewpoints=1

Will take a while to get acquainted with folks, but am always available, do not need to be a Vet, just seeking answers and having an open mind regarding spiritual warfare and what is offered to us in being equipped to fight this battle for the mind.

Can only offer what has been life changing for me:
http://www.raystedman.org/warfare/warfare1.html
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  #16  
Old 12-30-2009, 12:44 AM
chapmic
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Re: Important.....please read

Hello there from Tucson, Az. So kind of you to offer yourself. Of course that is all we have to heal with... our own temple. Mic Brewer/USMC
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